William Butterworth Eyewitness Account

• Place: Rochdale
• Role: Injured
• Occupation: Weaver

Testified at the Less Inquest. Describes how he was cut by a Cavalry-man, coming from the meeting house onto St.Peter’s field.

Account

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Name: William Butterworth

Occupation: Weaver

Home: Stakehill, Middleton

Date: 2 October 1819

Source: Lees Inquest  181 − 182

Summary: Described how he was himself cut by a Cavalryman coming from the meeting house into St.Peter’s−field, (offered corroborative support by Samuel Bamford).

_____________________________________________________________WILLIAM BUTTERWORTH called in by Mr. HARMER, sworn, and ex­amined by the CORONER.

Q. Where do you live, and what are you?

A. I am a weaver at Stakehill.

Q. Do you know any thing of the death of John Lees?

A. No, your honour.

Q. Do you know of his being wounded?

A. No, I do not, but I was wounded myself.

Q. Where were you when you were wounded?

A. I was near the gates of the Quakers'-chapel, after the hustings were cleared.

Q. Where were you at that time?

A. I was near the hustings when the Cavalry charged, and I ran towards the meeting-house, and was hurt amongst the timber.

Q. Did you see any one whom you knew wounded, near the hustings?

A. I saw the cutting going forwards there, but saw no one I knew wounded.  I got away as soon as I could.

Q. Were they the same soldiers who cut you near the meeting­-house, that surrounded the hustings?

A. Yes; the same regiment who were cutting at the hustings, pursued us there, and one of them cut me.

The Witness examined by Mr. HARMER.

Q. Do you know who cut you?

A. Yes.

Q. Was it one of those who came from the hustings?

A. Yes.

Q. What is his name?

The Coroner—I will not allow that. (To the Witness)—Did you see the man's face at the hustings to know him?

A. No; I turned my back when I ran away.

The examination of the Witness resumed by Mr. HARMER.

Q. Did the man who cut you say any thing?

A. Yes; we called out “spare our lives," and he said, “damn your bloody lives."

Q. Do you know by which Cavalry you were cut?

The Coroner—This is not evidence. He had not seen the indivi­duals at the hustings; the man who cut him might have come from another street, for aught he knows. I won't allow this; I see what you are after, Mr. Harmer.

Mr. Harmer—You, and Mr. Ashworth, have repeatedly said, that if you acted wrong, I had a remedy, and therefore I tender this evidence for your perusal, that if an application to the King's Bench should be necessary, there may be no question as to the nature of the evidence offered by me, and rejected by you.

The Coroner—You have heard my decision.

Mr. Harmer—Then you refuse to receive the evidence?

The Coroner—I do.

Mr. Harmer—Here is a witness, named Bamford, who tells me he can prove, that the Cavalry who went to the meeting-house, were those who came first up to the hustings. It is true, he has been in court all day, but still that is no objection to his compe­tency.

Mr. Bamford—I was present on the hustings, and can swear—

Mr. Harmed.—Stop; you cannot be heard until you are sworn.

Mr. Barrow—It is not admissible; he cannot be examined, having been present here, and heard what has been said by the other witnesses.

Mr. Harmer—Do you state that as a lawyer, Sir.

Mr. Barrow—I do: I say it is the practice; I have seen it done twenty times at the Assizes at Lancaster, and the justices here always do it, and I pledge what little legal knowledge I have, that this is the law.

Mr. Harmer—I cannot help saying, Sir, that on this subject Mr. Barrow has very little legal knowledge; and if it be law here, I can only assert, that I have never seen such law in London, and that the laws are very differently administered in the two places. If a witness remains in Court after the Judge's prohibition, it will be the subject of observation, and may go to his credit, but it cannot disqualify him; and see what mischief would result, if Mr Barrow's doctrine was established?—An adverse witness, or a man who wished to avoid giving evidence, has only to steal into Court, after such an order is made, his evidence is then to be re­fused, and justice defeated.

The Coroner—I agree with Mr. Barrow, that this is the law, and as the man has been in Court, I will not take his evidence.

Mr. Harmer-—This may be law in Lancashire.

The Coroner—(with great warmth)—I tell you what, Mr. Harmer, we have as good law in Lancashire, as you have in Lon­don, and can see as far through a mill-stone as you, Mr. Harmer.

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